darksiders
I have been feeling that music isn't what it used to
be.
Recording company's are giving the best opportunity to
artists that don't make music that relaxes my soul.(certain types of music )
Real artists with the best talent don't get the fame they deserve because of that.
I still download lots of jazz,pop,and blues but I want
change.The newest artists must put 100% of their
Love in the music they make. I'm a bassist and
clarinetist and I'm mastering these instruments at a very
quick rate.I think I can become the Next Micheal Jackson.
When MJ died I recognized that I need to work harder and continue
expanding my set of musical skills. On the best make it to the top.
This is the way I want to change the world.

Interesting topic Clarinetmaster and one close to my heart.

I'm afraid that popular music as been nothing but a waste of time for quite a while now.

From a musicians standpoint almost everything being done diatonically with popular must has been done centuries before by 'classical' composers, all the different melodic forms and devices that were tried and tested then are now being rehashed by popular musicians now. The only change has been the instruments being used.

Which brings me to another point, The instrumentation of most forms of modern music is diminishing. 'Classical' music draws upon many different types of instruments, drawing upon violins, cello's, guitars, clarinets and a myriad of other instruments. These lead to a natural complexity and gives a composer a great deal of resources to draw from.

Popular music has begun to adopt a standardized format of guitars and drum kits with a vocal soloist and there is little deviation from this format. There are additions of keyboards and backing vocalists but the two-guitar/bass/drum kit has become the 'industry standard' leaving limited options for what kind of sound or 'timbre' you can create.

Then there is the form of the music. A lot of music comes in the form of 'Verse-Chorus-Verse-Chorus-Bridge-Chorus' or some variation of this. This could most likely be related to the Rondo form of old which dates back to the classical era.

In this form you have different sections of music where the 'A' section (or chorus if you will) comes back over and over again contrasted against a different section with different material (a la a verse), example A-B-A-C-A-D-A etc. Its one of the simplest forms of musical composition and requires little effort to compose.

I'm sure you clarinetmaster must notice the simplicity of modern music. When I sit at my piano and play a modern popular piece of music I find it takes me little under 30 mins to master it.

By contrast I have spend the last two weeks or so mastering a Bach Fugue.

Music is being destroyed by commercialism. There has always been music that has been written for monetary gain, but music of the past was also written for art, to make a statement, to push the boundaries of what a musician could perform.

Music has become a commodity, that can be sold in 3:50 chunks to the public at a buck a time and it has suffered for it.

I agree with you my friend.
My brother is a composer and he also said
that it's'Verse-Chorus-Verse-Chorus-Bridge-Chorus.
I'm a very smart young boy and I think if I can work
and be the best out there, I can change everything.(not 100%)

Are a topic about music , you are right in my opinion as i am a lover of 80's , 90's style music . Good old Rock the way it use to be

I am thinking this should be in Music Discussions

yep but now we need fresh musicians that think outside the box.
(myself )
Move it mate

Moving to Music Discussions

interesting but no strictly true. Are you talking mainstream pop as appose to avant-garde modern music?

For me there are a lot of people still making great music in all genres. here's a selection

Autechre
Basic CHannel
Bat for Lashes
Biosphere
Boards of Canada
Dusk and Blackdown
Godspeed, you black emporer
Geir Jenssen
Gregor Samsa
J Dilla
JG Thirlwell
Jacob Kirkegaard
Sigur Ros
Six Organs of Admittance
Sunn 0)))


(remove the Still from J Dilla!!)

good popular music died in the early to mid 90s IMO

@HHRC
I mean the stupid hip hop,rap,and R&B
You are correct that there's still good artists out
there, it's just that the stupid recording studios
don't want to sign them. They have their damn monopoly with rap and hip hop artists.
They would rather hire a rap artist then a saxophonist because they get more profit. When I own a big recording studio company, I will change the world and it's musical preferences.
Rap artists would have to make their own labels so they can see how much money it costs.
@Mazuki-You have a point,but for some reason that's the time rap and hip hop started

i disagree, there was good rap (that i will admit i actually enjoyed) back then, and i will still find myself listening to if it comes on the radio

That depends on how old you are.

Having grown up in the "swinging 60s", I felt for a long time that good music died in the early 70s.

However, the fact is that there has always been innovative bands and good music around in every decade. You just have to look for it. And there are some great bands around today. IAMX is one of my current favourites.

My taste in music is eclectic, to say the least, so I find myself enjoying stuff that spans all genres and styles. There's a lot of good music out there. My biggest problem is that I lack the time to find it all.

Well...some rap is okay I have to admit even though I don't like the genre at all.
But my point is this: Music is meant to relax the soul.If your watching a video with
some rapper are you doing that?
No.
That is why I don't classify it as music.
I classify it as retarded rhyming with 50
girls in the background.Same thing with hip hop.
We need real musicians that don't only know how
to talk about sexy girls and ad MIDI sounds in the
background.If your a real musician, you don't treat
girls like your little toys in your videos,you don't cuss
and say random crap about how bad your life was,and you
don't encourage violence and sexism.
If you where a parent and your son said"Daddy can I listen to
a drug addict?" would you let him do that?
No.
I used to live in Detroit(the most dangerous city in the USA)
and everyday My mom had to keep me away from the gangsters
and gang members from killing me.
Unless you've gone thru hell like me and back then you would understand why
I say this.


nisakiman
Good I bet you know artists like Benny Goodman and the good swing.
The Music Inderstary will keep going down.
My goal in life is to change and stop this in it's path

believe me, i listen to the 70s 80s and 90s i know the "old" music better than my parents even, i was half tempted to say it died in the 70s, but it wouldn't have been true to me as i still enjoyed it past that, though i will admit that the 80s popular music is more of a make me laugh at how bad it is, and the 90s is nostalgiac, while the 70s just puts me in an all around good mood

can't drive a classic to la bouche after all

I must admit, the 80s were a particularly arid period - not much around at all. Spandau Ballet? Boy George & Culture Club? Human League? No thanks.

But then there was The Fabulous Thunderbirds! So it wasn't a totally lost decade!



And don't forget Sydney Bechet. Peerless!

there is good rap/hip-hop, which is away from the MTV BASS collective. Here's some great examples

J Dilla
Murs
Dilated Peoples
DJ Yoda
Black Milk
Illa J
Jedi Mind Tricks
Nas
The Pharcyde
Roots
Sa-Ra Creative Partnership

I agree


i believe you but what is like the topic in their songs?

I'll check out some of those bands. Never heard of any of them. There is something hypnotically appealing about some rap / hip-hop, but there is a lot of garbage out there, too.

It's like the early days of reggae (early 70s) - people only got to hear the mainstream stuff, like Bob Marley (who was actually a great reggae artist) and some of the UK based faux-reggae bands (some of whom were very good), but bands like Burning Spear, Bunny and the Wailers and Toots and the Maytals never really got any airtime outside Jamaica, so nobody in UK (I'm not sure about USA) was really aware of the fact that there were other great reggae bands out there.

You have to dig a little to find good music.

the collection of artists mentioned cover many topics but mainly black political issues in America. l




i agree with this, add to that the original upsetter Lee "Scratch" perry, Lloyd "Bullwackie" Barnes, Max Romeo, Junior Murvin or Aura Msimang Lewis and you have a good collection of less mainstream fantastic reggae. The same goes for todays hip-hop.

If you want to check out anything on the list go for Dilated peoples 20/20 or Jedi Mind Tricks "A history of Violence"

hmm....I've got a lot of listening to do before I can state my opinion on those artists

Thanks for the links HHRC, got them on my client now.

why is there so much hate on rap? there are rap artists that have true talent that actually rap about true life things. im in complete agreement with the crap that gets played on the radio like "stanky leg"... wtf is that? seriously, that song is the dumbest and simplest thought processed song ever. its worse that soulja boy's crap. no matter, i think this extends way past hip-hop/rap, for example, look at miley cyrus. she sucks. vanessa hudgens. she sucks. the jonas brothers. UBER suck. but you know why these idiots are signed? they appeal to the younger crowd who can push there mommy's and daddy's around to get there way and go pay an ungodly amount of money for an album. me, i love hardXcore and heavy metal. even with those, there are lots of bands that have flopped belly up for the record labels to scratch their stomachs with the wads of cash they make from making stupid catchy redneck rock. but thats just my thoughts.

Well,well,well...we have a rap liker in the discussion...
It's not music.I have a friend that has metal problems and he raps
good.It's not music because it takes NO REAL MUSICAL talent to make.
Do I hear any chords in rap?
NO
Do I hear something that relaxes my soul?
NO
Do I hear something that is sexist?
YES(not 100% of all the rap songs)

I lived in Detroit a long time ago so I know how REAL HELL is.
Don't argue unless you know what I've been thru

dude im not here to argue with you. not all rap is sexist, must be what you listen to, and idk what relaxes your soul. ok here, youre telling me that there is NO rap song out there that you do not like?

btw: i think you started this thread just to wait for someone to say they like rap so you could jump down from your cloud of "musical intelligence" to rape and pillage them. jeez man, this is a community, flaming is ok i guess, but jesus christ. if you dont like something and someone else does dont jump down there throat. personally i cant stand clarinets or any of the like, reminds me of band geeks. but im not gonna get all upset and pissy at you for it. and props to your bass playing man. thats awesome to hear seriously. i sing for a local band so having someone on an international board that is into playing music is awesome.

Slow down there folks, no need for this to fall into fisticuffs. Lest we awaken the wrath of the Mods

I agree that there are those who like rap and it is indeed an artistic form of expression of socio-economic conditions from which the rappers hale.

However I'm with Clarinetmaster on this in that I don't consider it music. Its a person speaking over a repeating bass track and whilst their lyrics and rhymes may indeed be truly inventive it is not a musical style.

It takes a great deal of literary skill to craft these spoken poems and to get the beat and meter to feel right, but It takes little to no actual musical skill.

What relaxes my soul is jazz,classical,R&B,and lots more types of music.
Good you sing for a band, I'd like to hear you.
I didn't start that thread for that reason, I started it because the musicians nowadays
aren't coming up with something new and cool.
Yes there is no rap song I like.Bass guitar is cool, I want to be like Marcus Miller.
It's not 100% rap and hip hops's fault that the music nowdays isn't selling
or as cool as from the past.
I agree with requiemvalorum is statement also

sorry to get upset, and i agree, i like the poems quiet honestly, and the beats in my car with my sound system... *drool* but other than that, youre correct. MOST rap takes no musical skill.

okay that is one the reasons I wanted to prove.
Make sure you don't go deaf
I just want more artists to try new things because
the only thing I see that's changing is jazz.
I'm happy to know this didn't turn into a flaming thread

same here. im just gonna tell you why i like it. as a singer, hearing others voices, melodies, and harmonic sounds regardless what type of music it is, i like hearing it. i try not to discriminate on any music because i know all music has an audience, therefore, im apperciative of it. ...except for miley cyrus, vanessa hudgens, and the jonas brothers... may they all rot... lol

Let me know what you think, i could easily recommend a few more, although hip-hop isnt my most favored genre, i consider myself a well informed audiophile!

good HHRC
@cfultz Those bad artists are bad I agree.
The only reason Disney let them do that
is to increase their profits

clarinetmaster

I do agree that you can't find a decent melody in songs anymore -- the instrumental art/skill has been replaced by 'talent' or just the industry pushing their low-cost howling dancer/photomodel prefab onto the market via the 'play my record and I'll give you an interview' trade. Some parts of popmusic are just a drumcomputer and some dimwitted lyrics now, and even then, they still need some auto-tuning crap to sound in tune

But I don't agree with the assumption that that isn't 'good music', as it can still be catchy and that's all it needs to be, imo

ADL_242
I agree with you ADL_242 but some of it is catchy and that's the only reason people buy it
It's bad that musicians today don't do anything different and that's why I only listen to certain music
from the past
Only a few musicians these days do something special.
When I become a musician, I will do new things that have never been tried or created so my music can actually
be different

We are apsolutly right if we say that the music is not what is use to be , when you see today's band and singers what kind off music are making it's a disaster i miss the good old rock'n'roll days

Hi God Of Thunder , Welcome to The forums

I do agree with you however there are many who quite enjoy todays music , being the younger generation .

Long live the great days of music 70's , 80's

clarinetemaster, i know exactly what your saying! i have felt that way for years now. i cant explain why and i dont thing anyone can explain it to me either.

the ONLY explanation that sounds right to me with other things in my life is that im getting older maybe nostalgia has something to do with it but thats the only thing i can think of!

Enjoy your life jblade, I think there may
be more reasons also but from your point of view your correct. (I'm only 12 so I understand )

I agree with what was said about music from the 70's (and I would say late 60's and early 70's). Much of it was inspired by the culture at the time. The war in Vietnam, Political Unrest, Riots, Sit In's and a new generation of "love". Although I enjoy many forms of music, this is still the stuff I pull out at night and listen to for hours on end.

I think the problem here is what you are looking for from your music.

I think your interrest in certain types of music rises and falls in direct proportion to academic musical training.

As a musician I listen to music that makes me think on an academic and emotional level. I look for music that does things differently, uses interresting instruments/devices.

I also look for music that would challenge me as a performer, music that is complex and has a lot of moving parts. Most of the music I listen to comes from the 1650's-1750's because this was the hight of polyphonic music. My favorite musical form is called a fugue. This is where up to 4 voices will be singing at the same but singing different but similar things.

This leads to layers and complexity that is frankly absent from modern music. There is so much to listen to in the one piece that you need to listen to it many times to get anything from it. here is an example of a fugue that was written by a famous concert pianist basically making fun of fugues but the music itself explains what a fugue is.
here is the most famous example of a fugue that most people have heard, The fugue begins at 2.26 in.


These things can be played on the piano and require the ultimate in technical prowess to be able to perform.

What has happened to music now is that the only means of expression is through lyrics. Whilst this isn't bad in itself its a simplification. You aren't encouraged to listen to a wordless piece of music and have your own emotional response to it, You are basically told in the lyrics how you are supposed to feel about the music. It takes the power away from the listener and makes expression of emotion easier for the composer.

All it needs is a catchy tune.

i was born in the 50s so i started to listen to music properly in the 60s ,and i have to say it was ok for the time ,i could never get into rock and roll as it sounded to dull for me ,i like music to take me on a journey ,i dawdled in the 70s with a lot of the underground stuff that was floating around ,but i have to say that around 1999 the music scene for me went up a few notches as the stuff coming out on the[underground] dance scene was inspiring ,i know a lot of you think of dance as repetitive beats ,well yes it has them and so does most music ,i liked to listen to the production and twist that were dropped in with a few sweet harmony's,and that music lifted my moods and i would always have a smile on my face [yes chemicals helped a bit], i listen to hard style trance and psych-trance today ,i loved hard house with its fast solid beats ,and all the chill out stuff that came from the dance scene still grabs me ,dance/house has close links with classical music in fact a lot of it is a updated take on a them , as for vocals on a music track ,i would be happy if they were far and few between ,and yes im another who is not that fond of rap ,it does nothing at all for me ,

so in response to the topic
i think the music has improved along with the delivery of it ,
with respect to rap & r&b lovers , i dont include rap or r&b in with that statement above,sorry

I for one do listen to rap and also some rock/heavy metal (techno is good too PLUR)

I think it's so stupid when you hear these "rappers" (and unfortunately the real good ones say it too) say oh yeah I think the rap music is so much more better these days and more secure blah blah blah. That's such bullshit, the rap industry is nothing but a fuckin fail (as far as mainstream goes) These so called "artists" suck. T-Pain, if it wasn't for that gay ass vocal thing he does on every single song (obviously to hide the fact that his voice sounds like shit) he'd be gone before he even came out. Lil Wayne, he uses that same vocal thing too from time to time. Lil Wayne sucks anyway he pretty much creeps me out too, if you ever hear him on a song listen to how many animal sounds he makes....same with mariah carey. Snoop Dogg sucks these days. Bone Thugs N Harmony is still OKAY I think this next album (UNI 5) is gonna make or break em, they're falling too much for the mainstream crap instead of telling horror stories like they used to. Soulja boy...pure shit. Dorrough, I like ice cream paint job but I haven't heard anything else from him. Please if one of you "artists" ever stumbles upon this page----spread the word THE RAP INDUSTRY IS TEH 3P1C F4IL!!!11!11!1




Quote from Soulja Boys Crank Dat Soulja Boy
"Now wa-me Yu cran da soulya boy" He takes the whole slang thing waaaay too far. At least say most of the words in your songs instead of sentence fragments.

I miss the 90's rap.
I'm also part of the younger generation (not that young though) The music I would say is being made more and more repetitive and if you notice some of them have really stupid sounds (like random noises you would hear in a cartoon) which leads me to believe we're heading (at least the teeny boppin girls) to a very dim generation and not to change topics but especially when most of the 12-16 girls are complete whores. Don't believe me? Go snatch your daughters phone and take a look through her sent/saved and received text/pic messages.

I totally agree 90s rap is where its at. A lot of the "rappers" today are suburban kids that don't know the streets so they got to rap about supermaning hos that they probably have never been with. I'm in college and my roommate listens to a lot of Lil Wayne he is garbage. I don't know how many times i've heard him say weezy f***ing baby, baby is a dude by the way. yet every time i point this out my roommate just ignores me about it. It really is sad that there is no gzas or krs-ones of today

You are 100% correct but the thing is if it's catchy,
there's almost a little chance that it's musically complex
or has any theory.
BTW Piano is the hardest and best(in terms of complexldy)
instrument in the world
I play clarinet and bass guitar because they are very flexable.

Now I don't rap but even with that genre,
it keeps going downward.This is the main
point of this thread.No matter which genre
of music we talk about,it's not as good as
it was in the past.

Finding something original now is very difficult.

Artists seem to come and go so quickly. Gone is the time when bands got to where they were because of their talent and not who they know/sleep with.

Yesteryear's bands stuck around releasing album after album over years and those albums contained music not "filler tracks".

i disagree
imo music has got better its the fans taste in what they think is music that has deteriorated ,
there is a lot of music out there that is not main stream and far superior to most music written /performed in the past,

As you mature your taste develops, so that new things don't have the effect on you that you remember experiencing in the past. Take it as a sign that you are growing older.

I agree to an extent that music was fresher in the 70's/80's but still feel there are bands out there pushing the boundaries ( mostly on the underground scene ).I will give you two bands you may weell of heard of or maybe not that are definately worth the time to listen to:-

THE DECEMBERISTS

I AM KLOOT.

very talented and underrated. IMHO

Well I have to agree with the title of this thread. At one time almost every song on an album was a hit. These days very few albums ever have more than 5 hits.

With the airways and video stations a lot of the stuff is [C]Rap music.

I agree

i don't think i'm that rusty as to not judge an album objectively. and about the underground, i'm sorry.. i imagined to be bigger (and more expressive) that it actually is.
many clubs are gone because people stay in, now with the internet. the scene is weaker because the industry has conquered every mean of expression - except for the internet. weird huh